Hello everyone--home safe & sound. Was sick most of my trip but still a great time. Have cat in car now and BF is driving us home.

Loved reading your posts! Tillie, yours is very instructive--thank you!

Hi Tatoulia 🙂
Happy you & kitty are back home again safely.
Sorry you were sickly while you were away(((HUGS)))
Hope my ramblings about clutter vs non-clutter were helpful LOL 😀

Been taking it easy today since all my "have-Tos" have been done.

Subclinical 🙂
Time is a very valuable commodity and there really isn't enough of it for us to do everything that looks interesting to us.
It is very important to decide what we most want to do and then make the time to do it.
This is where we set priorities as to how we will spend our valuable time. 😀

Makes me very sad to see how many years have been wasted by his hoard. ;P

Hello Tillie! I've managed to run the dishwasher and do two loads of laundry since I've been back. I need to do much more laundry and I should change my sheets but I think instead I'll just head to bed. Kittycat is purring away and naturally very, very cute.

I figure re the sheets I only slept on them fir half a week, do I can change tomorrow or the next day and it will be fine.

Good point re time, SubC. I question my choices of how I spend it.

Well I am heading off to bed--back to work--feels very restorative to have taken a week off. And even sweeter, only used 4 days since Memorial Day was in the mix.

Time itself is something we bring value into by occupying a certsin space/time with our consciousness. In and of itself, time is inert.

I am very cautious about the usual notions of valuing time. Is time spent asleep "time wasted"? In the past the answer would have been yes, but just now people are learning the value of sleep. I have never had proper sleep on an ongoing basis at any time in my entire life. I am still working towards having sleep at night and functional time during the day. My functional time now is still barely enough to cover survival tasks. If I do not spend most of my time in a resting state, my system will start blowing gaskets.

All Doing comes from Being. Time is valuable as a receptacle of consciousness. Time cannot be properly evaluated from a linear viewpint. It would be like evaluating an iceberg by the tip of its tip.

Hi tatoulia. I'm sorry you were sick too, but glad your week off helped you feel better.

You are starting to make me feel like I don't change my sheets enough.

Hi Tillie,

I can't imagine what it would feel like to have my to do list done. I think I was born with a to do list.

Hi Joan! Hi everybody!

Part of my hoarding problem came from not wanting to waste my time. I was raising and homeschooling three children. I am a very good at teaching and very good at kids, but, because I'm a hoarder, I'm very bad at the decision making purging process. So that was really slow and hard and ate up too much time.

I had to have someone review their work every year, so instead of curating a portfolio, when they were done with an assignment and we had gone over it, I threw it in a box. When the box got full, I started another box. And at the end if the year, I took all the boxes to the evaluator, who returned them to me after signing off (I'm not sure he ever looked in the boxes)

So many cool things came into my hands that might be useful for a lesson or a project...

When they were done with toys, all the toys went down to the basement for later - clothes, books.... Too hard to choose what to save. Don't have time. Gotta teach math/go to the library/do the laundry/bake/it's zoo day.... I'll get to this later.

Then the basement got full and the house started filling up....

Later never came. They grew up. I guess now is later.

Yesterday was pretty good. I made progress on my evaluations for my job, I helped dh with the addition, I picked the cherries in a timely fashion, I spent a little time in my garden, I worked on the studio (I started the red glaze), I emptied another feed box, and I went to bed with an almost clean kitchen.

All that came into the house was Dd's plastic Chinese take out container. It still has food in it.

Today I have to go out in the world. I will take some of the trash and all of the plastic bag recycling. Hopefully I will make good decisions.

Today I have to

Good Morning Everybody 🙂

Thoroughly enjoyed reading all of your posts!

Been having a rough time of it here lately.
Trying to maneuver through his hoard to accomplish even a simple task has been really tiring and frustrating.
To top it all off, he has not been the most pleasant person to be around.
So, yesterday I decided since he is being so nasty and negative and verbally abusive anyway I may as well push him to actually DO something.
I managed to get him to do something.
He emptied out one third of the bed of the small pick up truck.
Filled that empty space half way up with trash from the driveway and took it to the dump.
Returned home and repeated the process one more time.
If he would do this a couple hundred more times I may actually get to park in the driveway some day.
There are wasps nesting in all the rubbish, everything has at least one active wasp nest in/on it.
My plan for today is to continue to "ride his ass" to see if more can be accomplished.
This stuff is all broken, nasty and of absolutely no value to anyone. He is only keeping it because it's easier than getting up and throwing it away.
He doesn't want it, he never used it. He left it sitting out for years to rot.
I really wish that I had some support here to help me. Someone else to try talking to him because he doesn't listen and is always saying such mean nasty things.

Thanks for listening 🙂

~♡~Hello all you wonderful forum friends!!!~♡~
I cant believe how active this board has gotten! I have a long list of responses to all, but it keeps getting outdated cuz more posts get put up!
Tillie, i hope someday that you & your partner can come to an agreement of some kind. It seems he is using all that stuff as a way to fight with you.
Subclinical, i would hire you as a professional nagger in a NY minute!!!(i think that means fast?) ha ha..and i love the puzzle analogy!
Joan i also cringe every time i toss old food that could be compost. I tried composting, but kept messing it up. Im wanting to buy one that i can turn that gives it air ventilation...if i had a truck.
And i agree about appreciating my place! That helps me the most! Seeing a worse house than mine, freaks me out in a different way than a spotless house..ha ha
Tatoulia, the fact your cat loves it at your boyfriend's house just re-confirms my envy of y'all's relationship! That is still my goal! Im serious, you have been a huge inspiration in my path for that!
CM, ive been using your social worker's tactic of yelling 'squirrel' at myself when i get distracted, but my cats keep looking around confused....ha ha ;D
YES, IM AN INTROVERT!!! I love knowing i dont have to go anywhere or see anybody!
Ok, my big accomplishment has been finally getting that big kitchen cupboard completely cleaned & cleared & the counter on it is GORGEOUS right now, cuz i just put back 6 significant items,all clean & sparkly & i do not want to clutter it back up, so im gonna find another place for the rest of the junk that was on it....a lot can go in a drawer that i cleared. I just LOVE the way it looks now!!! ~♡~

Hi Tillie,

I'm sorry you're having a rough time. I'm glad you got rid of some of the hoard, but that sounds like a discouraging situation.

My son in law looked through my binder collection this morning and found four small ones and two big ones he wants to use for sorting out a bunch of records and photos he has in boxes.

Good for me passing them on, and hopefully good for dd, who would like the boxes dealt with.

Step by step.

Thank you for understanding. I would like hear (especially from Tillie or other non hoarders) if the bread thing seems reasonable or ideas to change it.

When my dd and son in law lived in a duplex, son in law used to freeze the compost in plastic containers and bring it when they came out to the farm. It drove dd nuts.

My friend's son runs a compost route. He picks up compostable food scraps from people who subscribe to the service and delivers them to a composting location on a farm. I'm not sure how the getting paid part works.

I had a compost tumbler. It's ok, but it's a batch composted, so yin need two. Because at some point you Havel stop adding things and just turn it. Also you have to be careful about the moisture level. Now I just have a three heap system. If I lived where I couldn't, might try an indoor worm farm.

Anony, I really want to know what six things you have on your counter.

Tillie! I was hoping you were taking a break yet I feared you were going through a rough time. That is something that you were able to get him to do some housework!. If we could just find a way to get him to exercise those muscles each day--as always, I feel a kinship since my brother is often nasty, degrading and abusive toward me. The language and the put-downs and the tone and the shouting. All so terribly hard to ignore. So terribly abusive and unfair. I am so so sorry that your life is so unnecessarily burdened.

SubC--you are doing a very good job keeping it all together! Just breathe and let some of it go--I am proud of you for not getting too anxious over the papertowels and for finding a little peace over coffee. Good job passing along the candle and the binders!

Giant monkey wrench in my day today. It's now 4:00 and I've been shuttling brother around. He is suffering, needed things, refused to go to ER unless i sat with him. I refused, gave him three options, he said he'd go to ER, then changed mind when I reaffirmed that I would drop him off and not stay. After I got back, he called to say he needed an ambulance/I went back, dropped him at hospital, drove around a bit looking for parking, ultimately came back home/not home but 20 minutes then he needed a ride home and a stop at pharmacy. This started at 7 AM. It is now 4PM.

I hadn't planned to fast today but haven't eaten yet and am thinking of making it a fasting day. I haven't done even one thing here. I will get to work on that now. I told brother my flight out is tomorrow, so I can get a moment to myself.

Ive become fascinated with compost! Maybe its the rebirth reality, maybe its the primal aspects, maybe its just that old, used up stuff can be useful?(ha ha)
The 6 things on my clean cupboard counter are; a brightly painted wooden fish from a trip to the Yucatan with my sister, an oil lamp from when i was trying to be solar,2 purple crystal antique vases of my Grandmother's, a colorful tropical glass with colorful glass swizzle sticks, and a Peyote Ceremonial mask i gave my Dad as a gift during his mask collection phase~♡~♡~♡~♡~♡~♡~each has special memories~....well, the drink glass doesnt, but its pretty & i like it!!! ~♡~ 😀

Ugh I haven't done enough and I'm aggravated right now. What a waste of a day. Very frustrated.

Quick hello--good to read your conversations, SubC, Joan & Anony. I'm on my trip. Very tired so heading to bed. Great work in the cupboard, Anony! It sounds beautiful & clean! The objects in it are terrific!

Hoping Tillie is OK.

Severe anxiety. Need to get that stupid car cleaned out and over to mechanic. I missed the garbage today. I have to get cat in her carrier to go to BF's and house is filthy. I've been doing some puttering this AM but very anxious. At least I have BF to help me with car situation. I will feel better once car is at the garage. Then I can start worrying about a lot of other things.

Hi Everybody 🙂

HEY!!!! PORTER!!!!! 😀
How's it going???????

Hi Tatoulia 🙂
Hoping you are having a good time and not worrying about everything back home. (((hugs)))

Hi CriticalMass 🙂
Did you get your bedroom neater?
One big road block people who tend to hoard run into
is striving for perfection.
If they can't do it perfectly they tend to freeze up and don't get any of it done.
Strive for "good enough" and then later on tweak it to make it even better. 😉

Hi Subclinical 🙂
About the food...
you have animals that need to be fed
the food is free and would be thrown out
as long as you only take what your animals will eat before it totally rots
I think that is a great way to recycle food that would usually go to the dump and be wasted.
But...
is it in your husband's way?
Does he have to fight his way around it to do things?
Is it attracting bugs or rodents?
What does he say about it being there?
He lives there too and if he has a reasonable complaint about it then it is not right to ignore his thoughts & feelings on this matter 🙂

Hi Joan 🙂
Compost here is no problem for me.
I toss every food type scrap out on the heap of raked up leaves & weeds.
Most food scraps never linger long because birds or skunks or "?" come by and eat it.

Hi Anonymoniker 🙂
WTG! WOOHOOOOO!!!!!
Wonderful that you finally conquered that cupboard!!!
I really like that you then decorated the freshly clear & clean counter top with some special things.
WAY TO GO!!!! 😀

Well another weekend is here, again.
Talked to him last night about him working to clear the driveway.
He just sat there looking at me, no response.
I want someone else to come here and deal with him.
I am so done trying
but I still want this yard cleaned up.
Anyways...
Have been keeping all the cats inside this week because the baby birds are fledging.
One fledged right in front of my face while I was out watering.
So cute! 🙂

Ok, doing better. Got car to garage after putting air in tires and battery jumped. Very glad BF was with me, we ultimately decided not to get it fixed and just got it inspected. We then found a place to park it so we can deal with it when I'm home from trip.

I'm going to finish packing then get back to puttering. Cat still here/we ran out of time so he'll come get her at 11 tonight.

Hope you are all well--missing you and would love to hear from you. Sorry I'm writing so much. Just ignore me/which loosely translates into please don't ignore me!

❤️

Anony, thank you for sharing, I feel like I can see your counter. It makes me smile for you!

Tillie, about the food:
as long as you only take what your animals will eat before it totally rots -
Because I have to take entire boxes, sometimes I bring home things that are too far gone or not ok to feed. Those things normally go in the compost right away because I normally get home half an hour before dh and unload the car. This week he was home early.

I then felt like I had to "sneak" the boxes down to the basement and have not had a good chance to sort all of them without him noticing and getting angry, and one may be getting tomato juice on the unfinished, carpet glue residue and rust stain covered, concrete floor.

My thought about that is that if I'm lucky the acidity will loosen some of the glue before I clean it up.

Usually there are only one or two boxes.

is it in your husband's way? -
He often doesn't go into the basement for weeks, so usually no, but right now he is doing some plumbing, so maybe.

Does he have to fight his way around it to do things?-
Again, no, but he did have to work around other things that could not be moved in part because of the boxes.

Is it attracting bugs or rodents?-
That's why I changed to using the basement - no mice, no raccoons, no flies.

What does he say about it being there?-
"Why do you have to bring home moldy bread?!"
"We can afford to buy chicken feed!" (But by "we" he means me. The farm expenses come out of my pay, which is small and also covers my contribution to the addition we are building, the continuing ed class I am taking this summer, and any "wants" I have - there is very little left these days for "wants". My big expense this week will be a lunch out with friends $10 tops.)
"I hate this."

He lives there too and if he has a reasonable complaint about it then it is not right to ignore his thoughts & feelings on this matter :)-
I am not ignoring his thoughts and feeling on the matter, I am just trying to understand how much of his complaint is reasonable, and how much is irrational. I think some of this is coming from his own issues - his mom starved the kids when he was little. He actually stole food from other kids lunches and he has ongoing physical consequences. And he should talk to his therapist instead of yelling at me. But I'm not sure, because it is an area where I am not always rational.

Also, as the hoard has diminished, the space in the house where I am allowed to "store" stuff has been slowly reduced. The basement is still on the list of my spaces, and he has said repeatedly that he doesn't care what I do down there as long as he has a clear path to the area with the electric box (he does) and everything is away from the walls (it is, except one storage rack that he placed.)

I hate the basement and would prefer to have one of the first floor rooms with light to work on my projects, but he wants them kept "nice" for guests. I am hoping to renegotiate after I have made more progress, dd moves out, and the addition is finished. But I would not store moldy bread in a guest room. Just sewing/quilting/spinning/knitting/teaching/scrapbook stuff. Maybe one project at a time that could be cleared away with a little warning.

Right now the guest rooms and dining porch still shift back and forth between usable and overwhelming so I have no ground to stand on.

Tatoulia 🙂
I have been reading every word (((HUGS)))
Have a safe trip, try to relax and enjoy every minute away.
Everything will still be waiting for you when you get back.
I know it's nice to have all loose ends all tied up before going away but that's really not important, really 🙂

Awww Tillie thank you for the right words at the right time.

I am puttering a little. Am packed. Didn't vacuum so as not to upset the cat. Am calling cab in AM for trip to airport. I think I'll be able to get cat in carrier. I'm tired but don't want to nap. Only about an hour til BF comes.

Thank you all for being good friends. Tillie, you are the best friend I could ever ask for. Sending you much love and strength.

Enjoy your trip!

The fact that vacuuming is even an option sounds pretty together to me.

My throw rug is rolled up on the porch wet because one of the dogs had an accident. I washed it but need to roll it out on the driveway to dry when the rain stops and then vacuum it. Meanwhile, I need to take advantage of the clear floors from the visit to really clean them before I start creating a bunch of "work stations" again.

the kitchen table gas already become a "file" for papers that ds returned to me. He took his "keeping box" when he moved out last year, and has sorted through it. He brought back cards and letters that were actually his sisters', a little bit of art he did as a kid, and the directions to some games.

Dd who lives at home already took care of her pile, but there is a card to her from my grandparents (now deceased) that she rejected and I wanted.

Lots of laundry, some lingering dishes. End of the year paperwork for my classes, and a garden to weed. Any progress on the actual hoard will be incidental.

I'll just hit a few highlights and then I need to scoot to church for quilting. But I've been checking in. Hoping your anxiety is all gone, Tatoulia, and Tillie, hope your frustrations are lessened. SubC, good idea to take advantage of those opportunities!

Me, I've been pretty scattered and so has my environment. Had some anxiety pretty strong yesterday but my prayer hour got me past that. Very thankful that it did! 🙂

Just busy with this and that, and hoping to get a handle on things like laundry and papers that have made my bedroom pretty messy. Plus those fragile items I bought home from storage to repack - only a few of those left. I'll feel a lot better when the bedroom at least somewhat liveable again. Monday I can finally take my garage sale donations to the church - yay! It'll feel good to have them out of my hair.

The sale is the 8th-10th. I'm going to shop then work a shift at it - but I promise to be good. Hoping I can find some clothes, maybe even shoes that I really do need and can't afford at retail prices.

Take care all - wonder how Porter is doing . . .

Hi SubC & CM. Good to hear from you both! Glad you'll be getting stuff to the church sale, CM. That will be a good feeling! I managed to get out a bag of recyclables before leaving this AM. I have three bags of garbage, which I won't be able to get out until Monday night. I get home Sunday, so hopefully not too smelly when I get home.

SubC I know that feeling of having papers piled up. So much to deal with. I don't know how people get through their papers. They are everywhere. I've gotten better but am hardly a model paper citizen. It's getting easier but still difficult.

Hoping for an update from Anony and Porter. Hope you are doing ok Tillie!

Got about 2/3-3/4 of the way done on packing the breakables yesterday. Close enough that I may just finish packing them at storage tomorrow, stopping by a liquor store or somewhere if I need a sturdy box or two.

I'm wondering about pushing myself just to arrange for and proceed with the move soon. Realizing it's never going to be as "perfect" and efficient as I'd wish - and that the whole point is to simply get the stuff closer so that continuing to deal with it will be easy, not requiring the planning and gasoline expense of a trip across town. I had left stuff at the current location in 2012 because although it wasn't right around the corner from where I was moving to, I didn't anticipate making the second move in 2015 to further in the oopposite direction.

On the 17th of this month, our city government is having a Housing Expo which I plan to go to. I'm not planning to move out of my friend's house that soon, but I'd like to see if there are resources that could be pertinent for me in the long term.

Anyway, today is an open-ended day and I'll just be around the house for most or all of it. So my big goal is laundry and doing what I can on my bedroom which is rather scary at the moment. I hope by bedtime tonight it'll be neater and more peaceful and liveable.

I too would like to hear about porter's move!

CM - so exciting that you are almost done packing your breakables! I still think it's great that you are going to quilting group.

I still am not back to my 100% (which isn't even close to normal 100%.). Also I had kind of a setback today. The basement is somewhat jumbled from the rapid clean up, and I had a large framed picture leaning against the side of a box. I went down to get a box of potatoes to sort out (if you don't sort through them checking for bad spots regularly, one spoils and then it gets left in and things get really ugly.) and as I was turning with the box held in both hands by cut out handles, I had to step over something. I bumped the picture with my knee, it fell, and I stumbled and stepped on it. The miracle was that the glass didn't break and I was ok, but that could have been really awful. It was a reminder that as far as I have come, my home is not safe, and I still have too much stuff and continue to make bad decisions.

I remember back when I first realized that I was a hoarder and started being honest with myself about the situation and taking responsibility, I was at the park with a friend and a couple she was friends with. I commented to my friend that I was planning to work in the basement that week, and the other woman said "oh,we need to clean out our garage. It's horrible!" I said "probably not this horrible." And she said "oh, I bet it's worse. We don't even let people in there because it's so embarrassing." And my friend said, deadpan, "I don't let my kids in her basement because they could die."

Yesterday evening I worked at the food bank. We had boxes and boxes of bread. Also greens in packaging. It seems like the grocery stores always gave too little or too much to give us. There is not enough refridgeration for these things - the space is taken up by dairy and eggs which people prefer. The room is not air conditioned. The bread goes moldy quickly.

And I was the only farmer there

Ruth kept packing things up because they had a sppt of mold or were getting limp or were too bruised. I asked her "how much of this do you want me to take?" And she said "it's you or the dumpster."

So now, my car is full of old bread and spoiled produce. I couldn't unload it all last night. I was tired and dh wanted me to do other stuff.

So now my chickens will eat well and free for a while, and I will recycle the bread bags instead of tossing them in the dumpster. But I also have a lot to do, and managing this will use my time.

Also I have no good place to store the bread. I was leaving it in the garage but a raccoon found a way in. - if I put it in the barn and a goat gets loose it could eat some and get sick (I have no secure storage in the barn) so I put it in the basement, and dh sees it and gets angry.

I try to see this differently, but my brain refuses. It is a small use of time that saves money and helps the environment. Both of these things make me feel good and I do not see the harm. Other people appear to consider this behavior normal (they think I'm weird for saving and recycling the case wrap, which mostly uses time when I would just be standing around at the food bank, plus two or three minutes to move to small bags at home and drop at the store when I go)

SubC, I can relate. I used to save all of my old food scraps and mulch them in a bin at a Whole Foods near me. Now they've stopped putting out the bin, and it is a dilemma for me. I end up now just throwing the food waste in the trash. I don't feel good about it, but where I live there is nowhere outside to just recommit the stuff to nature.

~♡~Hello all you wonderful forum friends!!!~♡~
I cant believe how active this board has gotten! I have a long list of responses to all, but it keeps getting outdated cuz more posts get put up!
Tillie, i hope someday that you & your partner can come to an agreement of some kind. It seems he is using all that stuff as a way to fight with you.
Subclinical, i would hire you as a professional nagger in a NY minute!!!(i think that means fast?) ha ha..and i love the puzzle analogy!
Joan i also cringe every time i toss old food that could be compost. I tried composting, but kept messing it up. Im wanting to buy one that i can turn that gives it air ventilation...if i had a truck.
And i agree about appreciating my place! That helps me the most! Seeing a worse house than mine, freaks me out in a different way than a spotless house..ha ha
Tatoulia, the fact your cat loves it at your boyfriend's house just re-confirms my envy of y'all's relationship! That is still my goal! Im serious, you have been a huge inspiration in my path for that!
CM, ive been using your social worker's tactic of yelling 'squirrel' at myself when i get distracted, but my cats keep looking around confused....ha ha ;D
YES, IM AN INTROVERT!!! I love knowing i dont have to go anywhere or see anybody!
Ok, my big accomplishment has been finally getting that big kitchen cupboard completely cleaned & cleared & the counter on it is GORGEOUS right now, cuz i just put back 6 significant items,all clean & sparkly & i do not want to clutter it back up, so im gonna find another place for the rest of the junk that was on it....a lot can go in a drawer that i cleared. I just LOVE the way it looks now!!! ~♡~

SubC, we've all had those days--so frustrating! I hope your today went better.

Right now I have to stay out of thrift shops. I can't stop buying stuff I can't afford don't need and won't fit anywhere. I have to constantly remind myself that sometimes things need to be cute without being in my house. I suffer so much. I really do.

It's 7PM and I'm still at office. Wish I could blink and just be home.

Hi everyone!
Joan, thank you for that interesting Egyptian card reading!!! It seems very accurate, too!!! I can see you also being a club! Do you think your mind gets in the way of your action? I do! Lately ive really been down on myself for my natural tendency to read, explore ideas, think about the world, etc., instead of getting to work on this horrid mess i call my home?!!
Just a few hous ago one of my 2 facebook pages went blank?!! Its apparently called 'the white page of death!!!' Im trying to look at it as a blessing in disguise, cuz i am hopelessly addicted to the internet & if a chunk of it is gone, then maybe, JUST MAYBE ill work on my house more???
Ive had a string of strange seemingly unrelated symptoms after my back, then hips hurt. I wont get into the graphics of it all. I dont know what is going on?
I almost feel like hiring somebody to just come over & nag me to clean my house...ha ha Itd seem more sensible to have them help me, but everything is a decision. I do not want to exhaust myself explaining & defending everything here. As silly as it sounds, i actually might really do that....i can just see my ad now... ~Nag Wanted: motivater needed to complete projects. No actual working involved. Must not be judgemental~ha ha

Anonymoniker, now would be the perfect time to hire that person - schools are getting out and there are a bunch of teachers with time on their hands.

That would be a great job for me! Could I knit while I nagged you?

Yesterday went a little better, but not enough better. I noticed that the last of the strawberries were starting to go and managed to wash them and cut them up losing less than a quart. And I got a few things out of the second guest room.

Today is my last day of school, and then I come home and cook, cook, cook, and clean, clean, clean! People start arriving at 11 a.m. Tomorrow. Dd says she will help me this evening, and everyone must eat leftovers for dinner (I need the fridge space)

She can sweep, make beds, and get the fruit salad ready. Only I can move the hoard.