Good Day Tillie

Wow, just the fact that's it outside. I thought it was bad she had a small porch jammed with stuff.

The vehicles there are two types of scrappers that take them. The scrap metal guys and those looking to resell for parts. But there has to demand for either. I recently had better luck selling to a parts reseller/junker. It took 1/2 dozen calls but I doubled the price of the metal scrappers.

Just like you said the collectibles should be displayed not tucked away in box in a pile. That's what I try to tell her, piles don't work for practicality reasons. Unless you sell collectibles at a show or auction getting a good price will be tough because those with the interest to check out a show or auction are the ones that really want them and will pay accordingly. And yeh why is it in a thrift shop at such cheap price(here she says you have to go the right thrift shop which is why her stuff in sitting around)

A case of xmas snow? OUCH. Only about a 2 month window to sell that. A case?

Hang in there. And keep posting because your experiences and comments have helped me alot.

Keep leading by example.

Good Morning Helprejected

What is really the biggest waste here is that he refuses to spend any money on necessary household repairs and this house is rotting into the ground.

But he will spend all the money on amassing more and more useless unneeded things.

He will never sell any of his stuff because nobody will ever pay him what he believes the stuff is worth.
There are many derelict vehicles rotting into the ground here.
They are only worth the price of scrap but he believes they are valuable vehicles that with a little work would run just fine.

I tell him to look up what his "collectables" have actually sold for on eBay, not the asking price.
He argues that those people don't know the true prices/values.
I argue that if the stuff were really so valuable he would not keep finding it for so cheap at thrift shops and yard sales.
I keep repeating that something is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.
Also that a true collection is supposed to be nicely displayed to be enjoyed.
Not stuffed away in a dark dirty garage.
He has no intention to sell anything.

I never buy anything because I think I can resell it.
I only ever buy things that I want and have a use for.

He will buy anything if he thinks it's a "good deal".
Example...
Store was selling spray cans of fake XMas snow for 50 cents a can.
So he bought a WHOLE case.
We never decorate for any holiday and where we live we actually get real snow.

So many other examples like that cluttering up this place too.

We have a great thrift shop here to donate to.
They will send two men with a big truck to pick up stuff.
I never have more than a few items to donate and most of my donate items are towels & sheets, etc. that I take to the local animal shelter.

I used to hope that he would learn and change by seeing my example.
He believes that I am ignorant and irrational only wanting and keeping just exactly the things I want and need and use.

All his time is spent contemplating his hoard. Tending to it's needs. Acquiring more and more things.
Then he adds to it all sorts of storage solutions like shelves, cupboards, bins and boxes that he has absolutely no room to set up and use.
Right now there are two very large and heavy metal shelving units he has way out in the driveway near the road.
He has no room to even bring them in any closer to the carport or garage because there is already soooooo much stuff.

But he keeps saying that all he needs to do is organize it and everything will be just fine.

It's insane, delusional and illogical and it's extremely frustrating to have to sit here and watch.

Worst part for me is that I have no support here in real life.
Best part is that I have the beautiful people here on Cory Chalmers's message board to give me support and encouragement. 😉

Hello Tillie

You nailed it with denial. Apparently he has it bad letting things spread outside. I empathize and offer support.

It's a shame because there are organizations like Habitat for Humanity that will take tools and some building materials. Even Goodwill will take tools. It's the waste of the letting many items sit and age. Here we went through several shoe box size containers of pens. Must have thrown out at least 2 dozen. Wound up freeing up a container. But she said she saved them to help tutor children. No parent in their right mind would let the child in that environment. Wound up throwing out several boxes of mold smelling books-she had to debate wether to air them out so she could read them.

The Star Trek and pop culture memorabilia is a tough sell unless one sells on line. Sometimes local malls and exhibition halls will hold a card show but that means you have to rent space and haul the stuff there. Could sell them cheap in a yard sell. The collectible market faded in the mid 1990s.

I gave up on selling stuff on money or lots of money and have little hesitation donating to charities if they will accept it. I've even given to local repair shops because I salvaged stuff for parts etc but realized after a certain point you take the good parts and toss it.

I think they want to make use of many of their things but the hoard becomes an overwhelming to do list

Hello again Helprejected 🙂

He loves to gather anything Star Trek and Star Wars and building/home improvement/maintenance materials and very questionable tools.
He is not at all good with his hands and never does anything with all this stuff, just collects it.
Like that makes him a skilled craftsman?
Even if something is good when he gets it he leaves it out there until it rots & rusts.

He picks up broken, useless things saying he will fix them or use them for parts to fix other broken crap.

Yes, he too believes he is sitting on a fortune of valuable desirable items that he could easily sell.
He also believes he has saved thousands of dollars by gathering up all this mess.
In actuality his hoarding is costing us everything.

Denial.
Denial about how long this has been going on.
Denial about what caused the place to be out of control.
Denial about just how dire the situation is.
Denial that they have a problem that they can not solve all on their own.

You have the Queen of Denial and I have the King of Denial.

Hello again Tillie

A 4 car garage full of stuff??? Along with other areas of the property/house? Uh-oh

You mentioned you're considered 'selfish' for not allowing storage in certain areas. No you are not selfish just practical and dealing with a full deck.

Is there a specialty or favored item he stores?

Here she thinks she can sell most of her stuff although when she won't give up 30 year old books she hasn't read yet have to wonder.

Here she's all but portrayed herself as the victim and in other instances. My guess is for the first time in life she's being forced to make decisions on many of these items and what ever meaning they have to her.

I now see why her family says they will only visit, not help her clean. I heard this years ago so there's been an issue with stuff alot longer than she wants people to believe.

Hi Helprejected

That is so exasperating!
She feels her unneeded, unnecessary, unused stuff is more important/has priority over the people in her life.

I had that same problem here inside my house until I put my foot down and demanded that I was entitled to have this space clear.
Of course he felt that I was being selfish and unreasonable.
But I removed all the clutter and have been defending my "No Clutter Zones" ever since.
He still thinks that I'm being selfish not allowing him to stack things all along the walls and cram things into the kitchen cupboards.

He has the entire 4 car garage that has an upstairs space too, a three car carport, the driveway and all the outdoor property completely packed full of "stuff".
The house is much smaller than the garage, so he has a lot more space to clutter than I have to live in.
But I am the unreasonable one?

I had to take a stand and stand up for myself, my space.
This is why I say that the people who she is using for storage space need to do the same.
Sometimes, with some people, it is the only way.
Yes, they get ugly mean and nasty when you push back but what other choice do we have?

As far as her own house, if she doesn't keep it up to code the officials will push back and she will be homeless.
As far as any stuff in storage, if/when she is in a nursing home unable to pay storage fees, after 3 months the storage company will auction off her storage units to the highest bidder and she will lose everything in storage.
But by then she won't need any stuff or have any need for any stuff.

This is so very frustrating and aggravating that she refuses to see the reality here.

Helprejected, you have been doing everything possible here to help.
Without her getting serious therapy you face an impossible task.
But yet you keep on trying.
Remember that you have NOT failed in any way (((HUG)))

Hello Tillie

The nursing home vs storage comes up every single conversation it seems. Her perspective and priorities are so far out of wack at this point.

I knew she would have issues with moving the stuff but I should've remembered how she treated a friend of her family. I don't know if I mentioned it but she did this to a family friend several years ago. A sibling past and a friend of family/ business owner agreed to let her store a deceased sibling's stuff in an unused business garage for a month or so. About 9 months later she balked about being asked to get it out. And got indignant with the owner when he caught her throwing left over food and liquid into shrubbery on their property. She went into a diatribe it's unfair speech.

Now were back to the 'last minute' because of cost. For some reason she thinks she only has to have her stuff out of the house that's being sold before the new owners move in. But that space is needed to other stuff in house and more importantly show how much space is in the house. For some reason she feels entitled to meet the same deadline as the family. But she's not family but a friend of a late family member. It's that sense of entitlement and rationalization-arggghhh.

Hi Helprejected

Sorry about the chemical stuff.
But even waste stations do not want that kind of stuff sitting around for too long.

That's insane.
Her excuses about finances, storage units for the stuff verses nursing home care.
People in nursing homes can't bring any more with them than just the bare essentials.
She needs to decide what is and will be a priority.
All that stuff or nursing home care.
She will lose all that stuff anyway and go into debt with nursing care expenses.
Everything she has will be lost. All property taken away to help pay the bills.

It always makes me so sad seeing how people with this hoarding disorder hold on so tightly to all the stuff when I can see that in the end they will lose everything simply because they just have too much stuff.

Much better to keep only the nice, necessary and useful stuff and let the rest go.
Life is so much easier this way. 😉

Hello Tillie

I checked about dropping household hazard waste at a central location and they said they only accept stuff from the public during one of those designated collection dates. Even the junk people won't take stuff like spray paint, paint thinner etc.

She staved off legal proceedings with her surprise visit.

But to listen and get lectured as to why she hasn't got her stuff out is extremely infuriating. She was always offered help and access to her stuff for years. And if nothing else she's had almost a year's notice to find a new home for boxes/stuff. If she wants to go through them that's on her. T

And she's keeps harping that paying for storage will prevent her for paying for a nursing home a few years from now. She could pay for 3 years storage unit rent which would be about 1/2 ONE month in a nursing home. She has no perspective or is simply blowing things out of proportion for effect.

Hi Helprejected 🙂
I've been wondering how you're doing.
Hope you have had plenty of time enjoying Summertime.

Those hazardous chemicals being stored for such a long period of time!
Have you found out when & where to dispose of them?

Some areas have a trash transfer station just out of town.
All the trash is taken there and collected up then taken to a dump somewhere.
And people can bring their own trash there.
Anyways...
some of the transfer stations also have bins for recycling and an area for batteries/lightbulbs and household chemicals too.

She sure is happy having people do everything her way with this alleged/supposed clutter cleanout.
She can just throw out any old lame excuse and nobody is calling her out on it.
The person who's home she is storing stuff in really should put their foot down.
Tell her all her stuff will be put outside, where she will have free access to it all.
Firmly state a date and time this will happen.
If she wants it she must come get it within 48 hours.
After that it will be picked up by 1 800 Got Junk.

I told a friend to do this. He had a person who had a whole room full of her stuff and never came to get it.
She showed up, took a few items and left the rest there.
So then I advised him to make a big sign "FREE STUFF" and people came out from everywhere and took almost all of it.
A neighbor then told him he could put the remainder in his trash can.

When the authorities come and force her out of her house and do all whatever they plan to do, the home owner storing her stuff won't get any help from them.
They are on their own.

Did anything ever happen with getting an attorney to help get storage units in her name?

If you had some place to move boxes to that would really help you to accomplish your goals there.

Has she stopped bringing in more/new stuff?
Sure hope so because bringing home more stuff just makes things almost impossible.

I honestly think she needs to be reminded what is at stake here.
She will lose her home and her independence.
Sometimes a bit of pressure is necessary to motivate them in the right direction.

Whatever happens, please remember that you must take the time to get away from all this.
Find enjoyable past times, spend time with friends & family.
Never forget that you have not failed.
You have been doing GREAT in a most difficult situation. (((HUGS)))

edit- she did NOT have regular access. Not 'she did have access'

apologies

Thanks Tillie. Your support and attention to posts/detail has helped me through this past year.

More of the same but the hoarder did pay a surprise visit to the home where her stuff is stored. She got right to business her way. She stayed in the car and brought multiple boxes to her. She is really playing the health angle now. Some real some probably not. Anyway she took a grand total of 3 boxes out the 5 she looked at in 2 hours.

She insists on going through every box she takes and wants us to throw out what she doesn't want. Problem is she has a large box of household hazardous waste including paints, cleaners, solvents etc. I told she have to take it to one of those free collection most communities run several times year. We can't throw that in trash.

Still hasn't made a decision on a storage unit for herself. AND insists the reason the stuff is at other's home is she did have access to go through it on a regular basis. Number one her disability would've prevented her from opening various doors or lifting boxes on her own even in her young days. But she had all the access she wanted and was told that on more than one occasion. All she had to do was give notice and someone would've brought or exposed her stuff for her. Regardless it was her initiative to take along with being her responsibility.

When you remind her of that she says well she wanted to come over when she wanted not needing doors opened, unlocked or other items moved. She won't admit it but she got frustrated/miffed that other stuff was put on top or in front of her stuff since she rarely asked about or accessed it maybe once a year. She was given storage space, not free run of a aisle in a department store. But she simply refuses to take responsibility for her hoard. She also does alot of virtue signaling saying how she will have all her stuff out of storage in less than a year.

All talk, little action.

Hi Helprejected 🙂

Hope you are having a good Summer with lots of time getting out to do summertime things.

Getting an attorney to set up the storage legally in her name is a great plan.

Once the unit has been secured, stuff can then be taken there and stacked.
I don't think she will ever in her lifetime know what is in the boxes/bins to complain about the condition of the items.
She will never open the boxes, just too many of them.

About the stuff stored at other people's homes...
Once there is a storage unit the people should move that stuff to storage.
Those people deserve to have their homes/spaces back.

But a simple single storage unit won't be able to hold everything so she will have to rent even more storage units.
And so on, and so on, and so on...

Since she refuses to cooperate and lease the units on her own, go ahead and get legal help to get them in her name.
This way you can get her house emptied enough to clean and repair so the house is safe and functional and in compliance with the local authorities.

That is your main goal, your original plan.

She has learned that her orneriness and talking over people has gotten her what she wants.
People back off and she is left alone to do as she pleases.

But time has come for you to act on her behalf and hire that lawyer.

Good luck and best wishes (((HUGS)))

Another blowup a week later. More lecturing and breaking the world record for the words per second that come out of her mouth. She got upset when asked about the progress she's made on removing her stuff from another's house/finding a storage unit. She's says bringing up the subject is unnecessarily yet she talks about all the plans for her stuff once in storage(more unrealistic goals). She's been offered help physically and given numerous ideas & websites to research prices, location etc for months.

And again she tries to control the conversation by over talking you and not letting you get a word in.The subject and tone of a conversation must go her way or she gets vigorously upset. It can happen in an instant. One wrong word spoken in a casual manner can set her off immediately.

Things are now at the point of getting a lawyer to get the details worked out to get a storage unit in her name so she is responsible for the bills. She probably get the move and first month for free. She'll also try to blame any damage on others yet much of stuff hasn't been looked at in decades and moved several times already.

Hello Tillie

Funny you mention physical and the kidneys. She hasn't had a GP in years and got mad at the local hospital where she used to go because they cooperated with/ worked with the social workers/authorities when declared a hoarder. But frequently complains about feeling sick. Then you say get it checked out. Then you get a diatribe how the hospital mistreated her when she was sited for hoarding. Complaining will not change anything.

It's just the never her fault. And keeps talking literally so you can't get a word in to jam her version of the story in as the only version.

I did some research because this isn't the first time she's gone on an angry rant and I get IED, intermittent explosive disorder-the symptoms fit perfectly. She's actually gone off on people on the phone hung up and called back to lecture them some more. And again it's never her fault.

AS usual your assessment of the situation is scary accurate. Which is good thing. Thanks Again

Hi Helprejected 🙂

Do you know when the last time she had a general physical?

Reason I ask is that I have known a couple of ornery crotchety older ladies who were so miserable to be around until a doctor discovered they had a low grade kidney/bladder infection.

Once the infection was cleared up their attitude improved.
They were still ornery but not as bad.
Plus a kidney infection can mess with your mind, thinking, memory, thought processes.

Well, at least you know she is the same about other situations and it's not just when trying to get her to declutter.

Of course, it's always someone else's fault that things are as they are.

Steven has excuse after excuse as to why he can't/won't clean up anything.
So frustrating that I have quit talking to him because I already know the answer.
Bla, bla, bla... ;D