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Hoarding Help Message Boards : The Daily Chat : Spirituality
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Spirituality
   

LR2014
Posted: 09 April 2014 - 05:43 AM
God and "my plans"

One thing that has helped me on certain days lately (and that will help me more, I believe, if I do it more consistently), is to make plans for the day (whether they are decluttering plans or other types of plans). Then I acknowledge to God (to "a Higher Power," if it's more palatable to you to use that terminology) that my plans may not be God's plans for me for that day. I try to think in terms of making plans, but at the same time holding them "loosely." That's not to say that I want to go with every whim that hits me that might throw off my plans; that's something I have done in the past, and it often prevents me from making clutter progress. Neither do I want to go with every inclination to drop everything and run "fix" someone else's problem. That's gotten me into more trouble than almost anything else in the past: spending inordinate amounts of time, physical energy, and mental energy dwelling on and trying to fix other people's problems. That can be an "addiction" in and of itself. I need not try to "play God" in other people's lives, thinking that I have the power to fix their problems, that I alone am "their savior."

So when I say "holding my plans loosely," what do I mean? One thing it means is that if things don't work out as I planned, I don't have to jump and scream inwardly because things didn't go my way. I keep in mind that my plans might not have been God's plans for me, and I can be more inwardly at peace about the day instead of being resentful that things didn't go the way I wanted them to. I can feel like I am more "in the flow of life." I can be open to God's plans for me.

Shifting to this way of thinking is a slow process. First, just making specific plans for the day that include specific decluttering plans is new in and of itself. Remembering to turn my plans over to God is not automatic at this point. But I'm making progress.
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LR2014
Posted: 28 March 2014 - 12:42 PM
Diane, I'm glad to hear you say, "giving up is not the answer,.." It can get very frustrating (understatement) when we look at what still needs to be done. Sometimes we don't really appreciate or even recognize all the progress we have made.

I relate to the ADHD struggles and to many of the other things you mentioned. Thank you for sharing your struggles.

You know, when we share our struggles, it can help us. But sharing our struggles often helps others as well. For instance, this morning, I started on a certain task that I originally intended to spend just a short time on (working on my floors). Once I was "rolling" with it, I wanted to keep going. (Sometimes to continue with a task longer than planned is OK and even good, but today, for me it would not have been the best thing.) Precisely because I had read about your "roof" story and had reflected yesterday about my tendency to do that same type of thing, I was able to recognize the behavior in myself today. I was able to stop that "floors" task and move onto the next thing I'd planned to do. So again, thanks for sharing. If you hadn't shared that, I might not have gotten some of the other things done that I did.
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Dave
Posted: 26 March 2014 - 06:21 PM
Many years ago we had a neighbor who had been crippled on one side from a stroke. One day I looked out the w indow and saw him working hard on potting some plants. I made a comment about how difficult it was and what he couldn't do. Mrs Dave immediately corrected me, saying that the issue was not what he couldn't do, but what he could do and how much he was accomplishing.
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Dave
Posted: 26 March 2014 - 06:09 PM
" I would like to be clear that I am using the term hoarder, and later clutterer, not to label someone who is suffering from computlsive hoarding or who has a tendency toward clutter, but rather as a shorthand way of referring to that person. I dislike the use of labels because labels are limiting and seem to obscure the potential for change that each one of us has inside of us. In using these terms, I am in no way indicating that a compulsive hoarder, clutterer, or even pack rat is the entirety of who that person is. It simply describes behaviors that impact the person's life."

Dr. Zasio, The Hoarder in You, p3, footnote.
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diane
Posted: 26 March 2014 - 04:57 PM
Thanks Tillie for reminding me, hoarding is just one part of me, and that I deserve love and respect. I have been on here a year now, and still am not done, so have given up and been feeling a little hopeless. My ADHD has me jumping from project to project and not putting things away. I find lots of things to do, but when nothing gets finished, looks like I have made no progress at all. When I realized last Sunday was my one year anniversary, I decided not to go to group, cause I felt like a loser, working so hard for a year and lots of mess still.
I did get through all the pants, and only ones I can currently wear are in closet now. I worked on removing years of build up on part of the roof all last week, like a mad woman, from early morning until dark, and neglected everything else. I have all spring/summer to do that. still all or nothing for me. I am frustrated. I was feeling frustrated with others that can't "find the time" to do essential things. Then felt bad that I was so opinionated, then continued to find fault with my progress. today I reread your posts and realize your encouragement is essential to me getting back on track. Giving up is not the answer, as much as I want to recently.
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Tillie
Posted: 25 March 2014 - 12:43 PM
You may have trouble with getting and keeping too much stuff and/or with getting the trash out and/or doing the usual house cleaning
BUT, you are all so much more than that.
The hoarding, cluttering & squalor is just one tiny little bit of the whole person that every one of you are.
You are a whole person deserving love and respect. (((HUGS)))
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Dianne
Posted: 25 March 2014 - 11:23 AM
LR, that was a beautiful post, thank you. I needed to read that today.

I wish you were in my real life world.
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LR2014
Posted: 25 March 2014 - 06:09 AM
I am glad we have a spot on here for spirituality.


One spiritual thought that I see some of you posting on here that is very important (but is hard for some of us to grasp at first) is that we are each valuable just as we are. I do not want to keep living with all the "stuff" I have in the past, but the changes won't happen overnight. Many of us have told ourselves a lot of negative things about ourselves through the years (and if we didn't, perhaps many others have said negative things to and about us). We may have come to see ourselves as "less than," or perhaps even "not valuable at all."

If the day comes when I have a clutter-free life, I may be able to function much better, but I won't be any more or less "valuable" than I am right now. I'm saying that as much to myself as I am to anyone else. trying to remind myself of that.

I think a beautiful example of this is one of my relatives. She was a hoarder all her life. (Runs in my family.) She didn't "want to" be like that, but she was. Now she is nearing 80, is in a highly specialized nursing facility, and can communicate only with gestures and with whispers (has a ventilator). And she is so deeply loved by me and so many people. I feel her love for me. We have a special bond, and I love to go visit her. We still "have fun," despite communication barriers. I will miss her terribly the day she leaves this earth (if that day comes before I myself leave this earth).

My relationship with her helps remind me of the truth of the things I wrote in the first paragraph. She is still a beautiful human being, hoarding and all. It reminds me that of all the things I need to discard, one of the most important things I need to throw away is the idea that I am "less than" because I have hoarding issues.
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Dianne
Posted: 23 March 2014 - 11:51 AM
Hi Trust God,

Yes, throwing away is hard. Recycling or giving to some one in need seems a much better use of resources. Unfortunately I've found that a lot of groups only want things in new or very lightly used condition. They don't want their recipients to feel as if they are only worthy of castoffs. Or they worry about what might be lingering in the donations ~ cigarette smoke, dust allergens, bed bugs, a musty smell, etc. I sold some things thru an Ebay store and one of the things they write to make sure their rep stays high is how many animals the seller has in the house; for fur and stink purposes I guess.

About spirituality and God's direction ~~ there were years in my life when I worked very closely in service to God. It is so very hard to know His will for you. I'm pretty sure that unless you have been called to live a life as a religious (priest, nun or third order religious lay person living in the world) He is not directing you to give everything away. That's from a Catholic perspective. Remember the bible verse about a time to keep. Even those who dedicate their lives to God must keep some things.

God knows your struggle and your heart. Your deep desire to understand and follow His will is what pleases Him. Imagine a little kid who wants to help his/her father with a grown-up problem that the kid doesn't understand. The dad knows the kid would do anything for him. The kid would give everything he/she has; toys, his piggy bank, her favorite blankie. Maybe the kid does give some stuff that may or may not help. But what the father really loves is the beautiful, giving spirit and open heart of his child.

Please remember that my opinions about God and spirituality are from my own experiences. If your relationship is telling you something different, you of course, know what's best for you.
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Roxie
Posted: 23 March 2014 - 09:03 AM
"Be still and know that I am God."

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Trust God and Clean House
Posted: 23 March 2014 - 06:54 AM
I like your recent post. Very inspiring. I get on through my phone. It's hard to get what I want to say on here. Takes alot of time & data. Lost one post I worked on really hard. Very depressing. Lent is always a struggle as I try to grow spiritually. Believe God is directing me to give it all away. Struggling to obey. Know that he will provide & care for us as always.

Recent bible study I was in covered the verses in bible where it talks about a time & season for everything under heaven. A time to keep, a time to throw away.

Throwing away is so hard. Recycling & charity's seem such a better use for our resources. Out of time again. ttyl
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diane
Posted: 17 March 2014 - 08:20 PM
Thanks Darci and Dianne, such a powerful post. If I believe God is guiding me and wants me to be happy, and that love in action is sharing my stuff with others. Why do I clench onto my excess stuff? Because my faith is that my stuff will make me safe, what if I truly understood that Loving God and loving people is what gives me joy, safety and comfort. My writing isn't as precise as yours, just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate what you have written and that it touched me deeply.
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Darci
Posted: 13 March 2014 - 10:20 PM
Diane: these are the words that really got me: I am actually going to write them down in my clean up journal.
where is my integrity if I speak of love and taking care of others while tightly holding on to the things that could be shared? Where is the trust in God that I keep professing to myself when I first turn to my material over-comforts and live with worry that I must keep everything?
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Darci
Posted: 13 March 2014 - 10:15 PM
Dianne, once again your words have really hit home with me about God and holding onto things that could help others. I have to remember your words when I feel my hands clenching something my heart doesn't want to let go of. Powerful thoughts you shared, thanks so much!
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Dave
Posted: 13 March 2014 - 10:42 AM
Dianne,
Just looking at the last paragraph of your second post-a thought that occurs to me.

You are NOT a HOARDER trying to fit in with God and other people. You ARE a PERSON trying to fit in with God and other people. Excessive gathering is only a part of who you are. Starting from where you have walked to now, you have been able to use the results of your excess gathering for teaching for your daughter and blessing for others not as fortunate at gathering as you. You have care for beings and objects around you. At the same time you are learning that you may have to have limits for the care that you extend. You are a valuable person. You have much life experience.

Your modes of expression run from anger and distress through enthusiasm to compassion. Perhaps God is allowing you to see yourself as a gemstone and explore your different facets. And do a little shining on the ones you don't think reflect Him properly. Which is success, not failure.
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Dave
Posted: 13 March 2014 - 09:56 AM
Dianne,
sorry about time gaps in response. I was busy with other posts yesterday and also needed to let my thoughts crystallize a bit.

Again today I spent a considerable amount of time creating a post and then lost it. I keep forgetting to get a copy before doing the enter key. Same reason my posts dont always come up in the bigger size - I just dont remember to do the size button.

Anyway, this replacement probably benefits from less rambling.
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Dave
Posted: 13 March 2014 - 09:51 AM
What I discovered while careening down the hall in my chauferred bed with nothing but my borrowed gown, footwarmer towel, and extra pillow was that the presurgical decluttering had not included mental things such as fear and anxiety and insecurity.

I believe hoarding researchers suggest that these mental states and resulting compulsions are some of the causes of hoarding behaviors.

There are many posts here which suggest that it is not good to force a cleanup on a person manifesting hoarding behavior.

A biblical reference here: (Matthew and Luke)Luke Chap 11: 24"When the unclean spirit goes out of a man, it passes through waterless places seeking rest, and not finding any, it says, 'I will return to my house from which I came.' 25"And when it comes, it finds it swept and put in order. 26"Then it goes and takes along seven other spirits more evil than itself, and they go in and live there; and the last state of that man becomes worse than the first."


The person with the hoarding behaviors now has resentment and additional insecurities added to their mental and emotional burdens. They also have a freshly emptied space to refill.

By implication, a person who is making an effort to declutter and change their behavior will reach a point where they will have to deal with these mental states. In a biblical sense, the person wanting to make changes can work to avoid a passive return of 8 bad spirits and work to effect a return of the prodigal son. That return being that their natural gathering impulses manifest in a more controlled manner and not to the excesses of hoarding.

I see no difference in hoarding behaviors and other kinds of human behavior involving fears and anxieties. I think there is a spiritual component to all of them and that the most effective methods of change will involve a spiritual element.
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Dave
Posted: 11 March 2014 - 06:36 PM
Preparation for surgery is a partial decluttering experience. They take all your physical stuff. No Binky. No Blankie. No Bear (or other friend of choice). (Although I might have been allowed a warm blanket for my feet.) They don't even allow plastic bags which leaves one terribly unprepared for the eventualities of life; such as springing up from the operating table saying "Excuse me, I'm a hoarder and I need these, while grabbing the surgical tools". :) However, they miss something ..
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Dianne
Posted: 08 March 2014 - 02:23 PM
My mind is whirling and I'd love to sit here and write for hours. Instead I'm trying to keep my focus on the goal of action, not the fun, time-waster of overthinking life.

About a year ago for some reason I forget, my eyes were opened to the mess in my bedroom. For a little while I sobbed and ranted and shook my fist against God who could let such horrible things happen to me (and to the rest of the world). It was a bit pointless because I was aware of the part inside me who said, God didn't do this to you, He gave you lots of good, YOU are the one who did this to you. As for the rest of the bad stuff that victims have no control over, I was still pissed.

It's a daily struggle for me to see where I fit in, what is my part, what is God's will, how do I know that (for sure), how can I help, how can I serve, where is my integrity if I speak of love and taking care of others while tightly holding on to the things that could be shared? Where is the trust in God that I keep professing to myself when I first turn to my material over-comforts and live with worry that I must keep everything?
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Dianne
Posted: 08 March 2014 - 09:45 AM
Dave and I have made a few passes at spirituality in other posts. I hope I'm not overstepping any boundaries in starting this topic.

Another thing that has encouraged me in this area is The Gratitude List started by Cory. He asked us to commit to 21 days of listing just 3 things to be grateful for. That was on Feb. 4 of this year. It continued past 21 days and I can see a definite improvement in my way of seeing things. Keeping the list to 3 was an excellent suggestion. Of course we can toss in extras if we want. But for someone like me, an all or nothing person, it was reassurance that a small amount is enough and will have cumulative good effects.

As Dave has said ~ I do not wish to lead anyone down a path they consider to be incorrect. Please make your own considered choices about that.

I am in complete agreement. What has worked, or not worked, for me are the results of my own lifetime of searching. Each path is unique and individual. What each of us may offer won't be universally appealing. But that variety is part of the beauty of life.
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